So awesome to see that God had us in mind regardless of our depravity.

Javetta-

Great post!

The new covenant scriptrures make some very dramatic claims about the old covenant scriptures. I am in the process of teaching a young man that I am currently discipling to see Christ in all the old testament scriptures!-Starting him off right!

Christs words:

“And He said to them, “O foolish men and slow of heart to believe in all that the prophets have spoken! “Was it not necessary for the Christ to suffer these things and to enter into His glory?” Then beginning with Moses and with all the prophets, He explained to them the things concerning Himself in all the Scriptures. –Luke 24:13-27

…Moses and all the prophets!

…Now He said to them,”These are My words which I spoke to you while I was still with you, that all things which are written about Me in the Law of Moses and the Prophets and the Psalms must be fulfilled.”-Luke 24: 44

…the Law of Moses, the prophets and the psalms…the entire old testament wrote about Jesus!

“But the things which God announced beforehand by the mouth of all the prophets, that His Christ would suffer, He has thus fulfilled.-Acts 3:18

…all the prophets!

Look at this:

“Of Him all the prophets bear witness that through His name everyone who believes in Him receives forgiveness of sins.” –Acts 10:43

…all the prophets taught that through the name of Christ everyone who believes in Him receives forgiveness of sin!

“So, having obtained help from God, I stand to this day testifying both to small and great, stating nothing but what (the Prophets and Moses said was going to take place;-Acts 26:22

…the prophets and Moses!

But when the fullness of the time came, God sent forth His Son, born of a woman, born under the Law, -Galatians 4:4

The entire old testament pointed to the fullness of time in which we now live in Christ!

with a view to an administration suitable to the fullness of the times, that is, the summing up of all things in Christ, things in the heavens and things on the earth. In Him.-Ephesians 1:10

…all things are summed up in Christ!

obtaining as the outcome of your faith the salvation of your souls. As to this salvation, the prophets who prophesied of the grace that would come to you made careful searches and inquiries, seeking to know what person or time the Spirit of Christ within them was indicating as He predicted the sufferings of Christ and the glories to follow. -1 Peter 1:9-11

…the prophets prophesied about the salvation and grace that was to come!

BTW: When you read my post tomorrow, keep in mind I wrote it over a week ago so a number of things that I say will overlap a little with what has alreday been said.

javetta, i dont think that any of joseph’s actions before he was reunited with his siblings were done with the idea of saving, or even helping his family. he has shed his identity, taken on the physical guise of an egyptian, he has married into the family of royal priests, and is living as an egyptian. he ends his life living like an egyptian. he preserved not a remnant, but all of israel. preserved, but not delivered. he allowed them to foster dependence and enslave themselves in what started as a gilded cage, but became their penitentiary. after the death of jacob, he could have seen their safe transit back to israel, but instead tells them that he saved them, maybe God would raise someone else to deliver them. i have to wonder how the amorites and edomites survived and thrived in the land of canaan, but israel did not. divine retribution for the deception and trickery practiced by the sons of israel upon the shechemites, and upon joseph himself. there are similarities to the Christ in there to be sure, but joseph does not make conscious effort to sacrifice himself in any way. he is brought to a point of prominence by God’s provision, only through revisionism or backward glancing can any of the travails he endured be said to be sacrifice for israel.

Charles-

I do not think the type teaching in the old covenant requires the participants/players to recognize or be conscious of the picture God was painting for those of us who look backwards to see. Similarly, I do not think the truth of Luke 24, Acts 3:18, Acts 10:43, Acts 26:22, Galatians 4:4, Ephesians 1:10, 1 Peter 1:9-11 required Ezekiel, Moses, Jeremiah, Isaiah and all the other OT prophets during their actual prophetic ministries to know they were speaking of Jesus of Galilee and His finished work on the cross.

Regarding the need for Israel to go to Egypt to be saved from the famine, it is clear from the text that if God had not led Joseph to make advance preparation and provision for the famine that all of the Egyptians would have perished and that God intentionally prepared a provision for Israel through Joseph in Egypt. I think the text is clear that other people groups from Canaan were making the journey to Egypt to buy food as well. So how many starved to death in Canaan and how many survived by buying from Egypt is really impossible to tell. Could Israel have survived without going to Egypt by just buying food from Egypt-maybe, probably, but it’s clear they ended up just where God wanted them to be as He is going to paint some more redemptive type teaching masterpieces for us through the events of the Passover and Exodus. Now we under the new covenant can sing the song of Moses and of the Lamb, slaves to sin and death delivered from our house of bondage and in Christ through His blood the destroying angel cannot touch us!

i certainly appreciate all of what you are saying here, hot chocolate. mind you, this is not what i was writing about. i was not writing about the lens through which we view the actions of any old testament character, rather i was responding to what had been represented as joseph’s intents and actions. not the outcome, not God’s purpose, but joseph’s. you may disagree with me, but please indicate where joseph in the midst of his captivity says to himself, “hey, this could really help my people”. he speaks of God’s purpose after he is reconciled with his brothers, when he is in the palm of egypt, but, i ask, where does he ever indicate during his struggles that this is an act of sacrifice? of course, i could be wrong.

That’s White Chocolate to you brother!

lol, sorry my paler but no less sweet brother! my email notification said it was lw. and i only read the email response, and did not scroll up to see your beautiful face. lol!

what about the grain? the curse of the bread? the grain storage facilities that joseph ordered built, with bricks made by the israelites? what about bricks in general? what does God think about bricks? what about the dwindling straw? there is so much more to talk about. the entire torah is a picture of Christ. Christ is telling the story to Moses. to discover Christ in any tale in the bible should not be too big a surprise. but what about the apparent minutia, and the lesser themes that run through out the entire book? could we be missing the opportunity to explore those, and learn about the personality of the creator, byrushing to the next chapter and simply saying, “yep, there’s Jesus”?
“…and more, he who has will get more…”

I hope not, that what your for! Grin. You’ve been doing a great job and frankly have brought up issues I have never considered. I’m learning a lot.

But one thing I know for certain is that to many people seeing Christ in the Old Covenant is not as familiar a thing as it is to you and me and others on this forum.

i am sorry for my pomposity. i must remember how exciting it is to realize that Christ is speaking to us in ways that we have not yet discovered. in fact that joy is one of the greatest joys there is, and i am sorry if i have diminished or denigrated that feeling in anyone. any new revelation of the Christ is cause for celebration.

Amen.

Vetta good post sister. All I have to say is Amen!!